This conversatio is with Ricard Solé, a leading thinker in complex systems and synthetic biology. Ricard heads the Complex Systems Lab at Pompeu Fabra University in Barcelona, where he explores how simple rules give rise to life’s astonishing complexity.We open with a thought-provoking question: Can a biologist fix a radio? — an idea from Yuri Lazebnik that asks if breaking things down into parts really explains how living systems work. Ricard explains why life resists simple mechanical analogies and why cells, organisms, and ecosystems can’t just be “wired up” like machines.Together we explore what we mean by “complexity,” how nature builds it through evolution, self-organization, and cooperation, and why emergence makes the whole more than the sum of its parts. We touch on termite nests, slime molds, brains, and immune systems as windows into collective intelligence and hidden patterns in nature.Guest info:Website: https://www.upf.edu/web/biomed/pdi/-/asset_publisher/vDntl1i7QlGn/content/sol%C3%A9-vicente-ricard/maximizedX: https://x.com/ricard_soleBluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/ricardsole.bsky.socialEpisode links: Website: https://reasonwithscience.com/how-nature-builds-complexity-ricard-soleYoutube: https://youtu.be/KRcqScqqunASpotify: https://open.spotify.com/episode/3n64g2SSyXSlzTmOXtE597?si=dNxmfjtFQMGsfY0qaQGaGwApple podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/how-nature-builds-complexity-ricard-sol%C3%A9-reason-with/id1641776894?i=1000719142144YouTube music: https://music.youtube.com/watch?v=KRcqScqqunA&si=MxOfuk6cvTRDJqtlFollow Reason with Science: Website: ⁠https://www.reasonwithscience.com/ ⁠Youtube: ⁠https://www.youtube.com/@ReasonwithScience⁠ Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5qFLGsPWjL4GAGidmF2nKh Apple podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/reason-with-science/id1641776894 YouTube music: https://music.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLila1Jm-QEwKu4xXtNpYFAsSDmPR9mlZB&si=5ehXeZhZ-z181G5bTimestamps:00:00:00 - Introduction 00:02:01 - Can a Biologist Fix a Radio? (Yuri Lazebnik's Analogy)00:03:36 - The Limits of Engineering Approaches in Biology00:04:50 - Hardware vs. Software in Cellular Systems00:09:01 - What Is Complexity? Emergence Explained00:10:18 - Collective Intelligence: From Termites to Slime Molds00:14:57 - Evolution as a Driver of Complexity00:15:54 - Major Evolutionary Transitions Defined00:17:27 - The Limits of Reductionism in Biology00:19:34 - What Complexity Theory Could Offer00:21:07 - Scaling Laws in Biology and Metabolism00:22:26 - Synthetic Biology and the Origin of Life00:26:44 - Information, Coding, and Pre-cellular Chemistry00:30:03 - Cells, Agency, and the Birth of Individuality00:33:37 - Liquid Brains: Immune Systems, Ant Colonies, and Intelligence00:37:58 - Synthetic Worlds: Rebuilding Evolution in the Lab00:41:06 - Language Emergence and Cognitive Space00:45:00 - Multicellularity and the Last Common Ancestor00:49:00 - Turing Patterns and Symmetry Breaking in Development00:53:36 - The Challenge of Modeling Organs in Complexity Theory00:55:03 - Plant Intelligence, Redundancy, and Morphological Plasticity00:57:14 - Slime Molds and Network-Based Computation01:00:00 - Fungi and Underground Intelligence01:01:04 - Liquid Brains: A Broader Framework01:03:00 - The Immune System as a Cognitive Network01:06:04 - Evolutionary Convergence and Constraints in Biology01:09:04 - Searching for Life Beyond Earth01:12:00 - Can Complexity Theory Predict Life’s Origins?01:17:04 - Synthetic Biology as a Tool for Discovery01:18:47 - The Origin of Neurons and Brains01:24:43 - Regeneration, Memory, and the Mystery of Planarians01:31:05 - Cancer, Evolution, and System Breakdown01:36:04 - Climate Tipping Points and Complex Systems01:39:00 - The Importance of Scientific Thinking01:47:52 - Final Thoughts and Reflections#reasonwithscience #podcast #biology

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