In this extra special episode, the boys are joined by Grant Hummer and Matt Liston, two of Ethereum's most original gangsters, to discuss the blockchain's complicated past, its mistakes and pitfalls, and what the future might hold for our favorite L1. Matt, a cofounder of Augur and Gnosis, previously worked for the Ethereum foundation, while Grant founded San Francisco's oldest Ethereum developer meetup. Assisted by your handsome co-hosts, our guests also explore the future of blockchain on Urbit, the pitfalls of inadequate leadership, startup pessimism, how to found a crypto religion, and the metaphysical ecstasy of blockchain contemplation. This is an episode you won't want to miss. Timestamps:0:00—Intro1:25—The dark, twisted history of Matt Liston5:15—The macabre, terrifying background of Grant Hummer8:01—Capital formation and the "Golden Age" of ICOs17:33—The state of Ethereum today (and the case for optimism)26:35—Crypto metaphysics and a blockchain religion37:14—Scaling, functional crypto, and the development of "fundamentals"44:59—Urbit, baby (and Uqbar)48:11—The mistakes of early Ethereum and the importance of leadership58:53—Is Urbit ready for the outside world?1:06:06—Wrap-up1:08:16—OutroMentions: Out of the Ether by Matthew LeisingThe Cryptopians by Laura ShinThe Infinite Machine by Camila RussoThe Tyranny of Structurelessness by Joe FreemanConnect:Matt Liston (~tacsup-datsynGrant Hummer (~habnec-fidlyx / @gphummer)~bichul-ritsen (@bichulR)~timluc-miptev (@basileSportif)~nilrun-mardux (@AlephDAO)And, if you liked the episode, don't forget to give us a five star review. Say something nice and we'll even read it on the pod.

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