Welcome to the Can Church Be Healthy?  Podcast — where a pastor and a therapist get curious about this experience we call the church, and the fruit it’s currently producing—especially here in the Western world. Hosts Jon Shirley (pastor) and Tom Page (therapist) take a thoughtful, honest look at why so many people today feel disillusioned, wounded, or just plain confused by church. From abuse scandals and political entanglements to the mistreatment of marginalized communities, the church is proving—far too often—to hurt more than it helps. So what can be done? In this podcast, Jon and Tom explore what’s broken, what’s worth reclaiming, and whether a healthier Church is possible.New episodes dropping soon.

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