Gail McDonald sits down with Dr. Joel Rothaizer, MCC, ABPP. He’s a Board Certified Psychologist, a Master Certified Coach through the International Coaching Federation, and a long-time executive coach. Together we explore the surprising overlap between coaching and psychology — and why coaches can safely borrow powerful techniques without crossing ethical lines. With more than 30 years of experience supporting leaders and organizations, Dr. Rothaizer shares practical, grounded insights that help coaches deepen their impact while staying firmly within scope.In this rich conversation, Gail and Dr. Rothaizer unpack the origins of the “coaching vs. therapy” divide, the false dichotomies that still influence the profession, and why the real foundation of both practices is the same: creating a safe, trusting environment where clients can be vulnerable, reflective, and open to change. They also explore developmental psychology, the Enneagram, emotional regulation, and how coaches can confidently navigate situations that may require referral.This Conversation Covers:The false historical divide between coaching and therapy — and why it still misleads coachesHow to create a strong “holding environment” that clients may describe as therapeuticThe four capabilities every great executive coach needs:A coaching modelUnderstanding of organizational cultureA framework for individual differencesA developmental model :Why clients struggle to take logical next steps — and how psychology explains those barriers• A clear, coach-appropriate explanation of the Enneagram and its use in understanding motivationWhen a client’s pattern points to a forward-focused coaching approach vs. a therapy referralHow to recognize your own “window of tolerance” during sessions and why it mattersThe ethical red flags coaches must not ignore — and how to handle referral conversations with careWhy mentor coaches are essential for self-reflection, ethics, and growthThis episode is a practical, eye-opening guide to the deeper layers of human behavior that shape coaching outcomes — and a reminder that powerful coaching doesn’t require stepping into therapy, only understanding people more fully.Dr. Joel Rothaizer, MCC, ABPPClear Impact LeadershipBook: Clear Impact: Building Your Leadership CapacityBooks & Resources Referenced:Awareness to Action Enneagram PodcastInternal Family Systems (IFS)"Window of Tolerance” framework

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