Government bonds saw one of the single greatest drops since their inception and international stocks were adversely affected by foreign conflicts. It was a challenging year to say the least. But, we firmly believe that a well-researched strategy of diversification (across asset classes of all types) can help investors endure these down market periods. Listen to the second half of our "2022 Year-in-Perspective" for a detailed review of market performance last year, and, discussion of our hopes for 2023. If you have any questions or would like more information, reach out to us at https://symmetrypartners.com/contact-us/ You can also find us on Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, and LinkedIn. As always, we remain invested in your goals. Symmetry Partners, LLC, is an investment advisory firm registered with the Securities and Exchange Commission. The firm only transacts business in states where it is properly registered, excluded or exempted from registration requirements. Registration of an investment adviser does not imply any specific level of skill or training and does not constitute an endorsement of the firm by the Commission. No one should assume that future performance of any specific investment, investment strategy, product or non-investment related content made reference to directly or indirectly in this material will be profitable. As with any investment strategy, there is the possibility of profitability as well as loss. Due to various factors, including changing market conditions and/or applicable laws, the content may not be reflective of current opinions or positions.   Please note the material is provided for educational and background use only. Moreover, you should not assume that any discussion or information contained in this material serves as the receipt of, or as a substitute for, personalized investment advice.   Show Notes/Transcript:   0 00:00:01.800 --> 00:00:07.300 Welcome back 1 00:00:07.300 --> 00:00:10.200  listeners. This is your host Tom romano, and thank you 2 00:00:10.200 --> 00:00:13.300  for joining us for part two of our 2022 year 3 00:00:13.300 --> 00:00:16.900  in perspective. Once again, we're joined by Casey Dillon 4 00:00:16.900 --> 00:00:19.700  to give us some insights on the markets and 5 00:00:19.700 --> 00:00:22.300  how they affected investors throughout the course 6 00:00:22.300 --> 00:00:25.600  of the previous year. Thanks for joining us again. Casey talked us 7 00:00:25.600 --> 00:00:28.400  a little bit. How did the markets react right? I mean we saw both 8 00:00:28.400 --> 00:00:32.200  equities and fixed income have negative 9 00:00:31.200 --> 00:00:34.900  performance for the year. And what 10 00:00:34.900 --> 00:00:37.400  are we seeing from rates of 11 00:00:37.400 --> 00:00:40.000  return from the US as well as abroad? 12 00:00:40.800 --> 00:00:44.200 Yeah, well the the sharp increase 13 00:00:43.200 --> 00:00:46.900  in rates reverberated across 14 00:00:46.900 --> 00:00:49.700  markets everything from stocks to 15 00:00:49.700 --> 00:00:51.300  bonds to real estate to commodities. 16 00:00:52.200 --> 00:00:55.300 And in what we observed was 17 00:00:55.300 --> 00:00:58.900  sort of some interesting things 18 00:00:58.900 --> 00:01:00.400  again threads that 19 00:01:01.300 --> 00:01:05.300 We'd seen coming into 2022 for instance. The 20 00:01:04.300 --> 00:01:08.400  the growth of tech stocks 21 00:01:08.400 --> 00:01:12.100  becoming a huge portion of 22 00:01:11.100 --> 00:01:14.600  the sort of the the US market, 23 00:01:14.600 --> 00:01:17.700  right? So if you you think about the Fang stocks Facebook 24 00:01:17.700 --> 00:01:19.600  Apple Amazon Netflix, Google 25 00:01:20.400 --> 00:01:23.700 They accounted for almost 25% of 26 00:01:23.700 --> 00:01:25.000  the market cap of the US. 27 00:01:25.900 --> 00:01:28.000 Coming into 2022 and they were 28 00:01:28.100 --> 00:01:31.400  the sort of those growth oriented tech stocks were the drivers 29 00:01:31.400 --> 00:01:34.600  of the tremendous returns 30 00:01:34.600 --> 00:01:37.000  that the market had given kind of the past five years. 31 00:01:37.800 --> 00:01:40.800 Or even ten and and to the 32 00:01:40.800 --> 00:01:43.100  point that there were a lot of folks who looked at that and said, 33 00:01:43.100 --> 00:01:47.200  hey, look are we out over our skis here this feels 34 00:01:46.200 --> 00:01:49.800  very much. Like we're entering into kind 35 00:01:49.800 --> 00:01:52.800  of frothy Tech bubble territory 36 00:01:52.800 --> 00:01:56.700  and there were sort of the Hallmark things 37 00:01:55.700 --> 00:01:58.300  trappings of 38 00:01:58.300 --> 00:02:01.200  that that were that felt very familiar to 39 00:02:01.200 --> 00:02:04.300  those of us who lived through the first tech bubble. So you saw things 40 00:02:04.300 --> 00:02:07.300  like the mean stocks right with games stop 41 00:02:07.300 --> 00:02:10.200  and Best Buy and sort of, you know day trading. 42 00:02:11.100 --> 00:02:15.300 To to the overuse of Leverage on these 43 00:02:15.300 --> 00:02:18.200  and a lot of that was kind of being driven by 44 00:02:18.200 --> 00:02:21.300  this idea that you know coming out of the pandemic these 45 00:02:21.300 --> 00:02:24.300  growth stocks. This was the story. These were the story 46 00:02:24.300 --> 00:02:27.700  stocks that people were gravitating to so so what happens people 47 00:02:27.700 --> 00:02:30.900  buy them up they to the point where the valuation 48 00:02:30.900 --> 00:02:33.200  no longer makes sense. If you 49 00:02:33.200 --> 00:02:37.300  take a step back and say well what am I buying right at 50 00:02:36.300 --> 00:02:38.000  the end of the day? 51 00:02:39.700 --> 00:02:42.700 Investing is about purchasing future cash flows. And 52 00:02:42.700 --> 00:02:45.600  so you arrive at a price today based on 53 00:02:45.600 --> 00:02:48.300  some assessment of what you think those future cash flows 54 00:02:48.300 --> 00:02:49.700  are and what you're willing to pay for those. 55 00:02:50.400 --> 00:02:54.300 If you get to a point where you're paying so much today for 56 00:02:53.300 --> 00:02:56.400  you know, this idea of 57 00:02:56.400 --> 00:02:59.400  heightened future cash flows at some 58 00:02:59.400 --> 00:03:00.800  point you enter into a world where? 59 00:03:01.600 --> 00:03:04.300 To to even substantiate the price you're willing 60 00:03:04.300 --> 00:03:07.900  to pay today. You have to have Perfection on those future casuals 61 00:03:07.900 --> 00:03:10.400  going forward and the world doesn't work that way right? You 62 00:03:10.400 --> 00:03:13.100  have a situation where Russia invades Ukraine, you have 63 00:03:13.100 --> 00:03:16.800  a situation where you have, you know pandemics and Avian flues 64 00:03:16.800 --> 00:03:19.300  and things like that. So the world is just in that 65 00:03:19.300 --> 00:03:23.200  need a place where you can predict Perfection 66 00:03:22.200 --> 00:03:26.000  for cash flows for things like yeah, Facebook 67 00:03:25.500 --> 00:03:28.200  Apple Amazon, and in fact what we see 68 00:03:29.100 --> 00:03:32.900 The the case for Perfection fell off the cliff in 2022 69 00:03:32.900 --> 00:03:35.200  because the the earnings for 70 00:03:35.200 --> 00:03:38.300  those companies started to turn around and go the other way and that 71 00:03:38.300 --> 00:03:41.700  caused Market participants to rethink the 72 00:03:41.700 --> 00:03:44.800  valuations that they were giving them and what 73 00:03:44.800 --> 00:03:47.600  we observed was the Fang stocks lost 74 00:03:47.600 --> 00:03:50.500  collectively over three trillion dollars in market 75 00:03:50.500 --> 00:03:53.300  cap over the course of the year. So that that 76 00:03:53.300 --> 00:03:56.700  was a homos 25% of the total market cap lost in 77 00:03:56.700 --> 00:03:59.400  the US was attributable to those handful of stocks 78 00:03:59.400 --> 00:04:02.000  right those those Fang stocks that you allude to. I mean 79 00:04:02.400 --> 00:04:06.200  at some point they were you know, collectively very 80 00:04:05.200 --> 00:04:08.800  large percentage of common us benchmarks 81 00:04:08.800 --> 00:04:11.300  like like the S&P 500, right they've been 82 00:04:11.300 --> 00:04:14.200  inflated and so when there is that correction, you're gonna 83 00:04:14.200 --> 00:04:17.300  feel it across the the industry across the all 84 00:04:17.300 --> 00:04:20.100  the markets rather. So I think that makes a lot of 85 00:04:20.100 --> 00:04:23.800  sense a lot of our investors are evidence-based investors, 86 00:04:23.800 --> 00:04:26.800  you know, Casey you and I share the same investment philosophy 87 00:04:26.800 --> 00:04:28.700  of buying hold. 88 00:04:29.500 --> 00:04:33.200 Long-term taking a factor approach to investment management. 89 00:04:34.800 --> 00:04:37.200 What how did factor-based investors or 90 00:04:37.200 --> 00:04:40.900  evidence-based investors fair in 2022? 91 00:04:40.900 --> 00:04:43.500  Yeah, so if you think about what what 92 00:04:43.500 --> 00:04:47.100  are you doing? If you're a factor investor? Well yours, you're 93 00:04:46.100 --> 00:04:49.700  lazing in on specific characteristics of 94 00:04:49.700 --> 00:04:52.200  risk to invest in and those 95 00:04:52.200 --> 00:04:55.600  character those risk factors those characteristics of 96 00:04:55.600 --> 00:04:58.200  risk that that you have 97 00:04:58.200 --> 00:05:02.300  been identified by way of academic research to have a 98 00:05:01.300 --> 00:05:04.800  premium or return 99 00:05:04.800 --> 00:05:07.600  associated with that that characteristics of risk. 100 00:05:07.600 --> 00:05:10.800  So you're trying to figure it 101 00:05:10.800 --> 00:05:13.500  out and say okay, you know, the the tech stocks 102 00:05:13.500 --> 00:05:17.000  is great example, the thing stocks if things become exceedingly 103 00:05:16.800 --> 00:05:19.300  expensive. Well, what does that 104 00:05:19.300 --> 00:05:22.300  do? Then to the cheaper stocks the stocks that aren't the 105 00:05:22.300 --> 00:05:25.800  thing stocks, right? How are they priced relative 106 00:05:25.800 --> 00:05:28.800  to these these growthier stocks? 107 00:05:29.500 --> 00:05:32.200 What historically we've observed is that 108 00:05:32.200 --> 00:05:35.700  there is a premium associated with valuation. Meaning 109 00:05:35.700 --> 00:05:38.700  the cheaper stocks tend to outperform the 110 00:05:38.700 --> 00:05:40.200  more expensive stocks over time. 111 00:05:41.300 --> 00:05:44.200 And so you enter into a world where the Fang stocks are 112 00:05:44.200 --> 00:05:47.800  ripping the cover off the ball and they're kind of the expensive growth stocks and 113 00:05:47.800 --> 00:05:50.300  by comparison, the the cheaper value 114 00:05:50.300 --> 00:05:54.100  stocks just aren't keeping up with that on the upswing and 115 00:05:53.100 --> 00:05:56.600  you got to a point where the 116 00:05:56.600 --> 00:05:59.100  market was collectively the one of 117 00:05:59.100 --> 00:06:02.900  the most expensive markets in history. Meaning that 118 00:06:02.900 --> 00:06:03.300  the 119 00:06:04.400 --> 00:06:08.200 thighs and weight of those Bank stocks across 120 00:06:07.200 --> 00:06:08.600  the market 121 00:06:09.400 --> 00:06:10.800 and how expensive they become 122 00:06:11.900 --> 00:06:13.100 lifted the whole market up 123 00:06:13.800 --> 00:06:16.300 But the spread between the growth stocks and 124 00:06:16.300 --> 00:06:19.400  the value stocks became as wide as we've 125 00:06:19.400 --> 00:06:22.400  seen really since the tech bubble right going back to 126 00:06:22.400 --> 00:06:25.200  that that the the value stocks were 127 00:06:25.200 --> 00:06:28.500  just so unloved and so beaten down my price relative to 128 00:06:28.500 --> 00:06:31.200  the tech stocks. So if you're 129 00:06:31.200 --> 00:06:34.400  a value investor rolling into a year like 130 00:06:34.400 --> 00:06:38.000  2022 when the the Fang 131 00:06:37.700 --> 00:06:41.000  stock bubble sort of starts to become deflated and 132 00:06:40.100 --> 00:06:44.500  those prices start to to come 133 00:06:43.500 --> 00:06:46.800  back to the mean if 134 00:06:46.800 --> 00:06:47.000  you will. 135 00:06:48.100 --> 00:06:51.400 One consequent of that is is that on a relative 136 00:06:51.400 --> 00:06:55.000  basis those cheaper value stocks start to perform better. Even 137 00:06:54.100 --> 00:06:57.700  if the market is going down as a whole the value 138 00:06:57.700 --> 00:07:00.400  stocks tend to hold up better because it's the 139 00:07:00.400 --> 00:07:02.900  top end of the market the expensive end. That's moving more. 140 00:07:03.700 --> 00:07:06.500 And so we we saw that and in 2022 value 141 00:07:06.500 --> 00:07:09.700  stocks actually did quite well, they did exceedingly well 142 00:07:09.700 --> 00:07:12.400  relative to grow stocks large 143 00:07:12.400 --> 00:07:16.100  cap value outperform large cap growth handily 144 00:07:15.100 --> 00:07:18.600  for 2022. And 145 00:07:18.600 --> 00:07:21.100  so if you're a value a factor investor with 146 00:07:21.100 --> 00:07:24.500  a tilt towards value that was really helping your portfolio in 147 00:07:24.500 --> 00:07:28.100  2022. We also saw factors like 148 00:07:27.100 --> 00:07:30.500  low volatility or 149 00:07:30.500 --> 00:07:33.900  associated with lower volatility stocks 150 00:07:33.900 --> 00:07:36.400  doing well across the 151 00:07:36.400 --> 00:07:39.200  board minimum volatility globally and 152 00:07:39.200 --> 00:07:42.500  also here in the United States. So those stocks that tend 153 00:07:42.500 --> 00:07:44.800  to be less volatile than the market in general. 154 00:07:45.500 --> 00:07:48.000 There's a return premium associated with that and of course 155 00:07:48.300 --> 00:07:52.000  in a year that highly volatile like 2022 those less 156 00:07:51.500 --> 00:07:54.400  volatile stocks had a premium associated with 157 00:07:54.400 --> 00:07:57.200  them relative to everything else. And if you're a factor investor who 158 00:07:57.200 --> 00:08:00.300  has a tilt towards minimum volatility you you reap the 159 00:08:00.300 --> 00:08:03.200  reward on that but it is as we sort of 160 00:08:03.200 --> 00:08:06.300  break out of kind of globally or looking at the US things like 161 00:08:06.300 --> 00:08:09.600  small cap stocks and Emerging Markets continue to do quite well. 162 00:08:09.600 --> 00:08:12.500  So if you had a tilt towards size in your 163 00:08:12.500 --> 00:08:15.500  Factor tilt that that paid off 164 00:08:15.500 --> 00:08:18.500  for you on a more broadly Diversified basis. 165 00:08:19.200 --> 00:08:22.700 And so you you started to see that these these 166 00:08:22.700 --> 00:08:26.000  Factor tilts in at 167 00:08:25.300 --> 00:08:28.100  a time when normally you would think a look 168 00:08:28.100 --> 00:08:31.700  if it's a risk off environment. Well Factor, it is 169 00:08:31.700 --> 00:08:34.700  a risk anyway, right? So you might 170 00:08:34.700 --> 00:08:37.800  expect for the factor exposures to 171 00:08:37.800 --> 00:08:40.300  be down it and to a degree you're 172 00:08:40.300 --> 00:08:43.700  right, but they're also relative to the other things that 173 00:08:43.700 --> 00:08:46.200  they're trading against and in that case they held up 174 00:08:46.200 --> 00:08:47.600  much better than the market in general. 175 00:08:48.300 --> 00:08:51.600 And so a broadly based a broad 176 00:08:51.600 --> 00:08:55.000  Diversified broadly Diversified Factor portfolio 177 00:08:54.100 --> 00:08:57.600  tended to do better on both a relative 178 00:08:57.600 --> 00:09:00.300  and absolute basis than the market in general 179 00:09:00.300 --> 00:09:03.300  did and certainly more so than the Contra points 180 00:09:03.300 --> 00:09:06.800  of that things like growth or more volatile stocks or you 181 00:09:06.800 --> 00:09:09.800  know, large cabs. So so being a factor investor 182 00:09:09.800 --> 00:09:12.500  really was beneficial in 183 00:09:12.500 --> 00:09:14.600  many regards in 2022. 184 00:09:15.300 --> 00:09:18.300 Yeah, we've seen that in the performance of a number of 185 00:09:18.300 --> 00:09:21.200  portfolios that that you and I have talked about over the 186 00:09:21.200 --> 00:09:25.200  years that you know, a diversified portfolio factors in 187 00:09:24.200 --> 00:09:27.400  2022 albeit was 188 00:09:27.400 --> 00:09:30.600  still in the red at the end of the year, but not nearly as as bad 189 00:09:30.600 --> 00:09:34.100  as some of those market like portfolios 190 00:09:33.100 --> 00:09:36.900  or benchmarks that we've seen. I do 191 00:09:36.900 --> 00:09:39.300  want to hang on the value conversation a little bit. Right? 192 00:09:39.300 --> 00:09:42.400  We you know value as a factor you and 193 00:09:42.400 --> 00:09:46.000  I share the the belief that investors should have exposure 194 00:09:45.200 --> 00:09:48.600  to value in their portfolios. And I know 195 00:09:48.600 --> 00:09:51.300  over the years Casey you and I have had shared a cocktail 196 00:09:51.300 --> 00:09:54.300  discussing. What was the underperformance of 197 00:09:54.300 --> 00:09:57.100  value for a number of years. We saw the rise 198 00:09:57.100 --> 00:10:01.300  of the things which we discussed earlier and for 199 00:10:00.300 --> 00:10:03.200  Value investors. I think that they were 200 00:10:03.200 --> 00:10:06.700  someone Vindicated in 2020 to but for 201 00:10:06.700 --> 00:10:09.900  those are out there listening, you know with this outperformance 202 00:10:09.900 --> 00:10:12.300  of value. Is there still room for Value to 203 00:10:12.300 --> 00:10:14.500  continue to outperform in 2023? 204 00:10:15.200 --> 00:10:19.200 You know, I love the quote history rare 205 00:10:18.200 --> 00:10:21.700  rarely repeats itself, but it often Rhymes because 206 00:10:21.700 --> 00:10:25.000  I think that that's incredibly true 207 00:10:24.600 --> 00:10:27.600  across markets in particular and I 208 00:10:27.600 --> 00:10:30.400  heard an a quote that I think shed some light on that and it's 209 00:10:30.400 --> 00:10:33.200  not that history repeats itself. It's that people 210 00:10:33.200 --> 00:10:36.600  repeat themself, right? And so if you think about markets are 211 00:10:36.600 --> 00:10:40.000  made up of people making purchasing and 212 00:10:39.300 --> 00:10:43.000  selling decisions across the board it it's it 213 00:10:42.200 --> 00:10:45.500  should be no surprise that in a similar 214 00:10:45.500 --> 00:10:47.200  type of dynamic or environment. 215 00:10:48.100 --> 00:10:51.300 People might Chase things like large cab growth 216 00:10:51.300 --> 00:10:54.300  tech stocks, right? And so if you look back to 217 00:10:54.300 --> 00:10:57.600  a time that was very similar to that during the tech bubble where 218 00:10:57.600 --> 00:11:00.900  you saw again Tech socks become very expensive and 219 00:11:00.900 --> 00:11:05.300  value stocks kind of be left to languish 220 00:11:03.300 --> 00:11:06.300  on the sidelines for 221 00:11:06.300 --> 00:11:09.300  some time when the tech Bubble Burst, right all of 222 00:11:09.300 --> 00:11:12.900  those growthy tech stocks valuation plummeted 223 00:11:12.900 --> 00:11:15.200  and value stocks had a tremendous run for several 224 00:11:15.200 --> 00:11:15.400  years. 225 00:11:16.700 --> 00:11:17.600 Well, where are we now? 226 00:11:18.200 --> 00:11:21.400 The we see these these Fang stocks the the air going 227 00:11:21.400 --> 00:11:23.300  out of them value having a nice run. 228 00:11:24.300 --> 00:11:27.000 So you might think is the run over. Well, if you 229 00:11:27.300 --> 00:11:30.600  look at the sort of globally the value spreads. 230 00:11:31.300 --> 00:11:35.400 So again cheap versus expensive we are still in 231 00:11:34.400 --> 00:11:37.800  the 90 plus percentile 232 00:11:37.800 --> 00:11:41.000  meaning it still one of the most expensive markets, 233 00:11:40.400 --> 00:11:43.700  right? So if we look at the, you 234 00:11:43.700 --> 00:11:46.400  know, nine out of 10 markets have been cheaper than 235 00:11:46.400 --> 00:11:51.100  the market that we're in currently even after 2022's price 236 00:11:50.100 --> 00:11:53.700  decline. So that tells you that value 237 00:11:53.700 --> 00:11:56.800  stocks, even though they had a tremendous year 238 00:11:56.800 --> 00:11:59.300  in 2022. The potential is there 239 00:11:59.300 --> 00:12:02.700  for them to continue to experience this 240 00:12:02.700 --> 00:12:05.600  reversion to the mean of these expensive stocks 241 00:12:05.600 --> 00:12:08.600  coming back down and value could have 242 00:12:08.600 --> 00:12:12.000  a run akin to what we observed post 243 00:12:11.500 --> 00:12:14.700  the tech bubble in the early 2000 when value 244 00:12:14.700 --> 00:12:17.900  was really dominant for a 245 00:12:17.900 --> 00:12:20.700  good three years in the marketplace. Now, 246 00:12:20.700 --> 00:12:23.800  I'm not suggesting that that it will exactly repeat itself. 247 00:12:23.800 --> 00:12:26.100  But you see the dynamic there in the case 248 00:12:26.100 --> 00:12:29.400  to be made for hey, it looks like there's still some fuel for 249 00:12:29.400 --> 00:12:29.900  this fire. 250 00:12:31.300 --> 00:12:34.200 And it would not be surprising to continue to 251 00:12:34.200 --> 00:12:38.100  see value run relative to the the 252 00:12:37.100 --> 00:12:39.100  more expensive stocks. 253 00:12:39.800 --> 00:12:42.300 Certainly, and you know, I think it's 254 00:12:42.300 --> 00:12:45.300  important for our listeners to know we're by no means suggesting people 255 00:12:45.300 --> 00:12:48.600  should speculate between growth and value. We think that you 256 00:12:48.600 --> 00:12:52.100  know factors specifically value are our 257 00:12:51.100 --> 00:12:55.700  long-term Endeavors and investors who maintain that 258 00:12:55.700 --> 00:12:58.500  exposure tend to do better over time 259 00:12:58.500 --> 00:13:02.000  is what I'm hearing you say and I 260 00:13:01.300 --> 00:13:04.200  and I lived through the tech bubble as you did 261 00:13:04.200 --> 00:13:08.200  and you know, those those years after where value did outperform 262 00:13:07.200 --> 00:13:11.400  they were still poor years, right 2000 263 00:13:10.400 --> 00:13:13.300  2001 weren't positive years in 264 00:13:13.300 --> 00:13:16.500  the market. And do you have any comments on you 265 00:13:16.500 --> 00:13:19.200  know value kind of shining during those downturns when 266 00:13:19.200 --> 00:13:22.500  we say values out performing. It doesn't necessarily I mean values positive, right? 267 00:13:22.500 --> 00:13:25.700  I think this is this the the Crux 268 00:13:25.700 --> 00:13:29.100  of why it's difficult to be a value investor because 269 00:13:28.100 --> 00:13:32.300  I mean sexually value investing 270 00:13:31.300 --> 00:13:34.400  is not hard to get your head around by cheap stuff 271 00:13:34.400 --> 00:13:39.100  and hold it right like that's not hard from sort 272 00:13:37.100 --> 00:13:39.500  of a conceptual. 273 00:13:39.800 --> 00:13:42.500 Went to get the hard part is actually doing it 274 00:13:42.500 --> 00:13:45.600  and being able to be patient through those 275 00:13:45.600 --> 00:13:48.100  periods when it doesn't look like 276 00:13:48.100 --> 00:13:51.300  it's working because those are those come right you 277 00:13:51.300 --> 00:13:54.300  you have those periods where the the tech bubble 278 00:13:54.300 --> 00:13:57.100  occurs where the Fang stocks are ripping the cover off the 279 00:13:57.100 --> 00:14:00.300  ball for five years in a row and your value stocks are languishing. 280 00:14:01.400 --> 00:14:04.700 Most investors the vast majority of investors cannot 281 00:14:04.700 --> 00:14:05.600  sit still through that. 282 00:14:06.300 --> 00:14:10.600 that's why value investing well easy to to 283 00:14:09.600 --> 00:14:12.400  sort of implement is hard 284 00:14:12.400 --> 00:14:15.700  to maintain and yet right what 285 00:14:15.700 --> 00:14:18.600  why do why do folks like you and I gravitate to 286 00:14:18.600 --> 00:14:21.500  Value as an important element of 287 00:14:21.500 --> 00:14:24.800  kind of a broad-based factor portfolio because 288 00:14:24.800 --> 00:14:27.600  the data going back over time 289 00:14:27.600 --> 00:14:30.300  suggests that if you can be patient 290 00:14:30.300 --> 00:14:33.500  through those periods when values not working the 291 00:14:33.500 --> 00:14:36.400  payoff for you when it comes in times 292 00:14:36.400 --> 00:14:39.200  like after the tech bubble when it comes when it 293 00:14:39.200 --> 00:14:42.300  comes in times like 2022 the payoff for 294 00:14:42.300 --> 00:14:44.500  you for being patient through that period 295 00:14:45.400 --> 00:14:49.300 And maintaining that that value exposure is 296 00:14:48.300 --> 00:14:51.600  significant enough such that 297 00:14:51.600 --> 00:14:54.700  over the total holding period you you 298 00:14:54.700 --> 00:14:57.100  end up ahead of where you might otherwise have been 299 00:14:57.100 --> 00:15:00.800  had you just had kind of Market level performance right? 300 00:15:00.800 --> 00:15:02.100  Just just broad beta. 301 00:15:02.900 --> 00:15:05.400 And so at the end of the day, you know, the question is, how 302 00:15:05.400 --> 00:15:08.200  do I out? How do I outperform the market? Well, one way to 303 00:15:08.200 --> 00:15:11.300  help perform. The market over time is to tilt towards 304 00:15:11.300 --> 00:15:15.000  these characteristics of risk, which have shown over 305 00:15:14.300 --> 00:15:18.000  time to outperform the market and values 306 00:15:17.100 --> 00:15:20.000  one of those now what I 307 00:15:20.200 --> 00:15:23.600  would say Tom is that it's incredibly difficult to just 308 00:15:23.600 --> 00:15:25.500  be a value investor and that's all you do. 309 00:15:26.100 --> 00:15:29.300 Which is why it's so beneficial to have a 310 00:15:29.300 --> 00:15:33.100  blend of factor exposures to have other things 311 00:15:32.100 --> 00:15:35.400  working when things like value for instance 312 00:15:35.400 --> 00:15:38.900  aren't so a good example of that is momentum, right? So 313 00:15:38.900 --> 00:15:41.300  it momentum and value are really nice 314 00:15:41.300 --> 00:15:44.600  pairing to put together in a portfolio because they're 315 00:15:44.600 --> 00:15:48.200  negatively correlated meaning when when values down 316 00:15:47.200 --> 00:15:50.400  momentum tends to be up and vice versa. 317 00:15:50.400 --> 00:15:53.400  So if the value investor if it's incredibly difficult 318 00:15:53.400 --> 00:15:57.300  to sit through those periods when value is not doing well with momentum 319 00:15:56.300 --> 00:15:59.200  exposures you end up 320 00:15:59.200 --> 00:16:01.100  having things in your portfolio. 321 00:16:02.200 --> 00:16:05.400 Which are picking up what's working and so in the case of the past five 322 00:16:05.400 --> 00:16:07.700  years a broad-based? 323 00:16:08.400 --> 00:16:12.100 Factor multi-factor portfolio would have value stocks 324 00:16:11.100 --> 00:16:15.100  in it, but it would also have some exposure 325 00:16:14.100 --> 00:16:17.200  to the fangs because those are 326 00:16:17.200 --> 00:16:20.400  representing kind of the momentum in the market until you have exposure to 327 00:16:20.400 --> 00:16:23.700  that and and that becomes an easier portfolio for 328 00:16:23.700 --> 00:16:27.300  most people to consume and sit through and the 329 00:16:27.300 --> 00:16:30.100  real magic here is the longer you 330 00:16:30.100 --> 00:16:33.900  can hold on to any of these Factor exposures. The more 331 00:16:33.900 --> 00:16:36.700  you have an expectation that you're going to have performance that's 332 00:16:36.700 --> 00:16:37.200  above Market. 333 00:16:37.900 --> 00:16:40.300 And and the real challenge for everybody is 334 00:16:40.300 --> 00:16:43.500  to sit still long enough to reap 335 00:16:43.500 --> 00:16:46.200  the reward of putting that Capital to risk. So you just trying to 336 00:16:46.200 --> 00:16:49.700  build a portfolio that people can actually stay in 337 00:16:49.700 --> 00:16:53.000  through these Market turmoil these ups 338 00:16:52.300 --> 00:16:56.000  and downs because if they can sit still there, you 339 00:16:55.400 --> 00:16:58.700  know it a bears make 340 00:16:58.700 --> 00:17:01.100  money Bulls make money pigs get slaughtered. Right? What does that mean? 341 00:17:01.100 --> 00:17:04.400  Look regardless of what your philosophy is, if you 342 00:17:04.400 --> 00:17:07.200  maintain that philosophy eventually the market 343 00:17:07.200 --> 00:17:10.400  will come around and rotate to you and pay you off for it. If you 344 00:17:10.400 --> 00:17:13.000  keep jumping from philosophy to philosophy trying to 345 00:17:13.400 --> 00:17:16.200  chase whatever is in front of you and get those returns. That's when 346 00:17:16.200 --> 00:17:19.000  you get slaughtered. That's when the cost of 347 00:17:20.300 --> 00:17:23.700 Trading in and out eats up your returns that 348 00:17:23.700 --> 00:17:26.200  that's when you're catching a falling knife. That's when 349 00:17:26.200 --> 00:17:29.200  all of these things that you hear why you might want to 350 00:17:29.200 --> 00:17:32.300  not want to be a growth investor or a value investor or 351 00:17:32.300 --> 00:17:35.100  right? All of those things can be true. If you're 352 00:17:35.100 --> 00:17:38.800  trying to find those things because the timing is is has 353 00:17:38.800 --> 00:17:41.900  been proven to be elusive if not impossible. So 354 00:17:41.900 --> 00:17:44.000  picking a philosophy and sticking with 355 00:17:44.200 --> 00:17:48.100  it as shown consistently over time to to be the way to go and we 356 00:17:47.100 --> 00:17:51.700  happen to believe in the philosophy of what's been 357 00:17:51.700 --> 00:17:54.100  shown from the academic research to be these 358 00:17:54.100 --> 00:17:57.200  characteristics of risk that pay off over time certainly and so 359 00:17:57.200 --> 00:18:01.300  in a nutshell, it's time in the market versus 360 00:18:00.300 --> 00:18:03.600  timing. The market is the best course of 361 00:18:03.600 --> 00:18:06.600  action. I want to hit upon something 362 00:18:06.600 --> 00:18:09.900  that you're alluding to and that platitude or 363 00:18:09.900 --> 00:18:12.700  it sounds like a platitude to most investors, especially 364 00:18:12.700 --> 00:18:15.400  when the markets down right telling them. I'm 365 00:18:15.400 --> 00:18:18.300  in the market not timing the market that doesn't mean much to somebody 366 00:18:18.300 --> 00:18:19.700  who's like am I gonna be able to retire? 367 00:18:20.200 --> 00:18:23.500 Right, but you have to understand where that platitude 368 00:18:23.500 --> 00:18:26.200  comes from right where where that rule of thumb comes 369 00:18:26.200 --> 00:18:30.600  from any and it is informed by 370 00:18:30.600 --> 00:18:34.400  decades upon Decades of observations 371 00:18:33.400 --> 00:18:36.400  of how markets behave 372 00:18:36.400 --> 00:18:39.600  and where returns to markets come from. Yeah. That's an excellent 373 00:18:39.600 --> 00:18:42.100  point. You were alluding to 374 00:18:42.100 --> 00:18:45.000  diversification Factor diversification but diversification as a whole 375 00:18:45.300 --> 00:18:48.300  and there's one thing I'd like you to comment on, you 376 00:18:48.300 --> 00:18:51.300  know, I've been hearing in Reading in popular press and 377 00:18:51.300 --> 00:18:54.100  in the various industry trade Rags that you know 378 00:18:54.100 --> 00:18:57.700  diversification didn't work in in 2022. My 379 00:18:57.700 --> 00:19:00.200  thought on that is that I think it's a misunderstanding of 380 00:19:00.200 --> 00:19:03.100  how diversification actually works and I'd love to hear your 381 00:19:03.100 --> 00:19:06.100  thoughts on that. Yeah. So you sort of 382 00:19:06.100 --> 00:19:09.400  come back to well. What are your expectations? I went 383 00:19:09.400 --> 00:19:12.600  when when you hear someone like you or 384 00:19:12.600 --> 00:19:16.400  I say, hey a broadly Diversified portfolio is 385 00:19:15.400 --> 00:19:18.900  is the starting point for most 386 00:19:18.900 --> 00:19:19.800  investors like 387 00:19:20.200 --> 00:19:23.500 Everybody should have if you're going to invest you should do it in a 388 00:19:23.500 --> 00:19:26.400  fashion that allows you to take advantage of broad-based diversification. 389 00:19:27.300 --> 00:19:30.800 If your expectation when you hear that is, oh, okay. I'll 390 00:19:30.800 --> 00:19:33.200  never lose money. Well, no that that's not what we're saying, 391 00:19:33.200 --> 00:19:36.500  right? The the point of broad-based diversification 392 00:19:36.500 --> 00:19:39.800  is you're taking off some of the idiosyncratic risk 393 00:19:39.800 --> 00:19:42.200  of any one kind of investment meaning. 394 00:19:43.400 --> 00:19:47.000 All I want to invest the only thing I know about is expensive wine 395 00:19:46.600 --> 00:19:49.200  French wine, right? That's the only thing I know about that. 396 00:19:49.200 --> 00:19:50.200  The only thing I want to invest in 397 00:19:50.900 --> 00:19:53.400 So if that's my investment philosophy the risk 398 00:19:53.400 --> 00:19:57.500  that I have is that the the wine 399 00:19:56.500 --> 00:19:59.800  market goes away people, you know, 400 00:19:59.800 --> 00:20:02.100  they're tasting preferences. They no longer want 401 00:20:02.100 --> 00:20:05.200  to drink expensive wines. We see 402 00:20:05.200 --> 00:20:08.600  a shift in the in the wine market where French wines are are no 403 00:20:08.600 --> 00:20:11.700  longer as highly valued as California wines, for 404 00:20:11.700 --> 00:20:14.100  instance. And if I've invested in 405 00:20:14.100 --> 00:20:17.400  a bunch of French wines, just the shift in the market now, I have 406 00:20:17.400 --> 00:20:20.700  a dramatic impact in my portfolio and or 407 00:20:20.700 --> 00:20:23.400  you know fires in 408 00:20:23.400 --> 00:20:26.700  California and drought in France and 409 00:20:26.700 --> 00:20:29.400  suddenly the wine market has absolutely no 410 00:20:29.400 --> 00:20:32.600  Supply. And so the 411 00:20:32.600 --> 00:20:35.300  price of what you're holding goes up dramatically, but then 412 00:20:35.300 --> 00:20:38.500  when it's gone, it's gone, right and then what do you invest in? So 413 00:20:38.500 --> 00:20:41.300  so the the risk of investing in any one 414 00:20:41.300 --> 00:20:45.600  thing you may know that thing inside and out but it's idiosyncratic 415 00:20:44.600 --> 00:20:47.200  to that thing. You're 416 00:20:47.200 --> 00:20:47.900  investing in like wine. 417 00:20:48.900 --> 00:20:51.700 So, you know the idea is with 418 00:20:51.700 --> 00:20:54.400  diversification. Yeah, okay invest in wine, but while 419 00:20:54.400 --> 00:20:57.900  you're doing that can we find some other things to invest in that are 420 00:20:57.900 --> 00:21:00.600  going to behave differently than Wine does 421 00:21:00.600 --> 00:21:01.100  because 422 00:21:02.200 --> 00:21:05.400 If the risks come to bear for wine, you don't get wiped out. 423 00:21:06.100 --> 00:21:09.400 Right. So we want to invest you know in a fashion 424 00:21:09.400 --> 00:21:12.300  that allows us to sort of achieve these long-term goals without getting 425 00:21:12.300 --> 00:21:15.300  wiped out along the way. So instead of investing in 426 00:21:15.300 --> 00:21:18.100  wine. Maybe we invest in, you know, 427 00:21:18.100 --> 00:21:21.100  small cap stocks in the United States and those are 428 00:21:21.100 --> 00:21:23.200  gonna look and behave very differently than the wine market. 429 00:21:23.600 --> 00:21:27.100 And maybe we invest in Emerging Market 430 00:21:26.100 --> 00:21:29.200  debt because we know that that's gonna 431 00:21:29.200 --> 00:21:32.700  behave differently than Securities and wine 432 00:21:32.700 --> 00:21:35.200  and maybe we invest in treasuries and 433 00:21:35.200 --> 00:21:38.200  maybe right. So as you start to go down that path you look at 434 00:21:38.200 --> 00:21:42.100  all of the different things you can lay around that are going to behave differently 435 00:21:41.100 --> 00:21:44.500  from the other things that you're holding. That's not 436 00:21:44.500 --> 00:21:48.700  to say that when a systematic level 437 00:21:48.700 --> 00:21:51.600  risk comes along like a pandemic or 438 00:21:51.600 --> 00:21:54.500  Rising interest rates that all of those things aren't 439 00:21:54.500 --> 00:21:58.100  going to be impacted by them. They will be right your your 440 00:21:57.100 --> 00:22:00.800  wine your small counts dogs. You're you're 441 00:22:00.800 --> 00:22:03.200  treasuries, right? You're you're emerging market 442 00:22:03.200 --> 00:22:06.400  that all of those things are gonna be impacted if there are 443 00:22:06.400 --> 00:22:09.300  issues that are roiling markets across the 444 00:22:09.300 --> 00:22:12.600  board. And and so if you're expectation going 445 00:22:12.600 --> 00:22:15.300  into a broadly based Diversified portfolio as I'll 446 00:22:15.300 --> 00:22:16.700  never lose money, or it'll never go down. 447 00:22:17.100 --> 00:22:20.200 That's the wrong. I would like to disabuse you of that notion. 448 00:22:21.200 --> 00:22:24.400 What you should expect is if any one or two of these things 449 00:22:24.400 --> 00:22:27.200  are impacted by a risk specific to it. 450 00:22:27.200 --> 00:22:30.500  I'm not going to be wiped out and that's why I would have a 451 00:22:30.500 --> 00:22:33.500  broadly based portfolio Diversified portfolio. Now, 452 00:22:33.500 --> 00:22:36.000  I will say that if a part of your 453 00:22:36.800 --> 00:22:39.800  diversification are things like Factor exposures. Well, you 454 00:22:39.800 --> 00:22:42.400  you end up often doing 455 00:22:42.400 --> 00:22:45.200  better than the market even if the markets down 456 00:22:45.200 --> 00:22:48.200  and your portfolio is down you end up doing a 457 00:22:48.200 --> 00:22:50.100  bit better than the market did in general. 458 00:22:51.100 --> 00:22:54.500 And if you look at like a sick just a generic 60 40 portfolio. 459 00:22:55.400 --> 00:22:57.700 It was one of the worst years on record for. 460 00:22:59.100 --> 00:23:00.600 1640 board folios 461 00:23:01.400 --> 00:23:04.200 because stocks and bonds both went down 462 00:23:04.200 --> 00:23:08.600  dramatically in fact bonds had a historically bad year led 463 00:23:07.600 --> 00:23:10.300  by treasuries which had the 464 00:23:10.300 --> 00:23:13.300  worst year since the you know in 200 and 465 00:23:13.300 --> 00:23:16.300  something years, right? So a 60 40 466 00:23:16.300 --> 00:23:20.500  a broad base 640 portfolio being down is unusual. 467 00:23:19.500 --> 00:23:22.300  It's Unique to have 468 00:23:22.300 --> 00:23:25.300  that experience, but it's also 469 00:23:25.300 --> 00:23:29.100  not unexpected given the the 470 00:23:28.100 --> 00:23:31.100  Catalyst for why all of those 471 00:23:31.100 --> 00:23:31.900  things were down. 472 00:23:32.900 --> 00:23:35.800 That doesn't mean you abandon that that 473 00:23:35.800 --> 00:23:38.300  investing discipline. It just means that 474 00:23:38.300 --> 00:23:43.000  you should expect there are going to be times when broad-based 475 00:23:41.400 --> 00:23:44.100  diversification isn't going to 476 00:23:44.100 --> 00:23:48.800  be the thing that saves you from experiencing a 477 00:23:48.800 --> 00:23:49.500  downmark. 478 00:23:50.300 --> 00:23:53.300 So it sounds like there's like two two things that you're bringing 479 00:23:53.300 --> 00:23:56.800  up here, right diversification certainly provides you with some 480 00:23:56.800 --> 00:23:59.700  protection from concentrated stock concentrated 481 00:23:59.700 --> 00:24:02.300  industry or even sector right? Like you bring 482 00:24:02.300 --> 00:24:06.000  up wine a great way to sort of 483 00:24:06.400 --> 00:24:10.300  balance that out by maintaining diversification. But however diversification is 484 00:24:10.300 --> 00:24:13.600  not going to necessarily protect you from the natural ebb and 485 00:24:13.600 --> 00:24:16.400  flows of the market, right? Those are gonna continue to happen 486 00:24:16.400 --> 00:24:19.400  but the market risk and I 487 00:24:19.400 --> 00:24:23.000  think you would agree is that that's what rewards investors for deploying 488 00:24:22.100 --> 00:24:25.200  their Capital into the market. Why would I invest 489 00:24:25.200 --> 00:24:28.500  broadly in you know, the S&P 500 well because 490 00:24:28.500 --> 00:24:31.300  there's risk associated broadly with the SD, but and 491 00:24:31.300 --> 00:24:34.700  I should be paid for doing so you're absolutely spot on right? Yeah. Why 492 00:24:34.700 --> 00:24:37.200  are we investing in anything because there's risk associated with 493 00:24:37.200 --> 00:24:40.200  it and that risk generates return, right? Yeah risk and return our 494 00:24:40.200 --> 00:24:43.600  absolutely Inseparable and I think it's it behooves investor 495 00:24:43.600 --> 00:24:46.200  to keep that investors to keep that sort of Mantra in 496 00:24:46.200 --> 00:24:49.200  mind so Casey, thank you so much for 497 00:24:49.200 --> 00:24:50.100  your comments. I do have 498 00:24:50.400 --> 00:24:53.500 Last question for you, you know, we covered the current events 499 00:24:53.500 --> 00:24:57.100  how that affected the markets, you know investors are 500 00:24:56.100 --> 00:24:59.400  listeners are looking at the retirement 501 00:24:59.400 --> 00:25:02.500  accounts. They're seeing a lot of red. What advice 502 00:25:02.500 --> 00:25:05.300  would you give investors? What should 503 00:25:05.300 --> 00:25:08.100  they do going into 2023? What are some of the things investors could be 504 00:25:08.100 --> 00:25:11.800  doing now? Well, you know, my my knee jerk 505 00:25:11.800 --> 00:25:14.200  response to that is nothing right. So if you're 506 00:25:14.200 --> 00:25:18.000  if you're a discipline investor maintain that discipline, right? 507 00:25:17.300 --> 00:25:20.600  There's no question 2022 was challenging year 508 00:25:20.600 --> 00:25:23.300  for investors. And there is likely, 509 00:25:23.300 --> 00:25:26.500  you know, these issues that we've been talking about they're not resolved. 510 00:25:26.900 --> 00:25:29.800 Right and in and in fact, there will be other things 511 00:25:29.800 --> 00:25:32.300  that will Royal the markets layered on 512 00:25:32.300 --> 00:25:35.400  top of these like for instance a fight over 513 00:25:35.400 --> 00:25:36.300  the debt ceiling, right? 514 00:25:37.300 --> 00:25:40.700 So there's likely more turbulence ahead. However, right the 515 00:25:40.700 --> 00:25:44.200  the best option for the long-term investor is 516 00:25:43.200 --> 00:25:46.300  to find a philosophy that 517 00:25:46.300 --> 00:25:49.500  makes sense for them build a portfolio around that and 518 00:25:49.500 --> 00:25:53.100  then maintain the course maintain 519 00:25:52.100 --> 00:25:54.200  the discipline. 520 00:25:55.800 --> 00:25:58.300 Through up markets down markets, you know turbulence in 521 00:25:58.300 --> 00:26:02.000  the headlines the it's the discipline of maintaining 522 00:26:01.200 --> 00:26:04.800  that philosophy over time that is provides the 523 00:26:04.800 --> 00:26:07.600  reward for long-term investors and their steadfast 524 00:26:07.600 --> 00:26:08.000  patients. 525 00:26:08.800 --> 00:26:12.700 Through these short-term Market movements or macroeconomic 526 00:26:11.700 --> 00:26:14.300  events are the things 527 00:26:14.300 --> 00:26:18.000  that are going to generate returns for them over the next Century, right? That's 528 00:26:17.500 --> 00:26:20.900  it just is what it is. It's what it has been for 529 00:26:20.900 --> 00:26:23.600  those investors who are looking at 2023 here are 530 00:26:23.600 --> 00:26:26.400  some statistics. Hopefully that will Empower you to maintain 531 00:26:26.400 --> 00:26:30.800  the course over the sort of the past Century 532 00:26:29.800 --> 00:26:32.600  the US has endured 15 533 00:26:32.600 --> 00:26:33.600  recessions. 534 00:26:34.500 --> 00:26:37.700 In 11 of the 15 or 73% in 535 00:26:37.700 --> 00:26:37.800  time. 536 00:26:38.400 --> 00:26:41.500 Returns on stocks were positive two years after the 537 00:26:41.500 --> 00:26:42.300  recession began. 538 00:26:43.200 --> 00:26:46.900 With an annualized average Market return 7.8% So 539 00:26:46.900 --> 00:26:49.800  if you're concern going into 2023 is always 540 00:26:49.800 --> 00:26:52.100  it gonna tip into recession. Should we be concerned with 541 00:26:52.100 --> 00:26:55.700  what the FED is doing? Are they gonna go too far? My answer to you 542 00:26:55.700 --> 00:26:59.100  would be look recessions are not new with the 543 00:26:58.100 --> 00:27:00.300  we've experienced them. 544 00:27:01.500 --> 00:27:04.300 Over time in fact more frequently than 545 00:27:04.300 --> 00:27:07.200  you would think and yet in a vast majority of those 546 00:27:07.200 --> 00:27:10.100  recessions. If you just have the patience to ride through 547 00:27:10.100 --> 00:27:13.400  it you're rewarded on the back end of that to to 548 00:27:13.400 --> 00:27:16.300  the tune of sort of a healthy average annual Market return of 549 00:27:16.300 --> 00:27:16.800  almost 8% 550 00:27:17.200 --> 00:27:20.500 So going into 2023 expect volatility 551 00:27:20.500 --> 00:27:23.300  expect there to be things playing out in the headlines. Do not 552 00:27:23.300 --> 00:27:27.000  let that pull you away from the long-term 553 00:27:26.600 --> 00:27:29.800  discipline and know that the the 554 00:27:29.800 --> 00:27:33.200  rationale for why you're investing over 555 00:27:32.200 --> 00:27:36.400  the long term is sound and 556 00:27:35.400 --> 00:27:38.400  you have expectation that this too 557 00:27:38.400 --> 00:27:40.500  shall pass and I'll be rewarded for that patients. 558 00:27:41.300 --> 00:27:44.500 Yeah, absolutely discipline and patience tends to be the biggest Catalyst 559 00:27:44.500 --> 00:27:47.600  for rewards for investors over the long term and going 560 00:27:47.600 --> 00:27:51.000  into 2023, you know investors who might be uneasy 561 00:27:50.500 --> 00:27:54.000  unable to sleep at night concerned about their portfolios. 562 00:27:53.300 --> 00:27:56.500  They should go meet with their financial advisor. 563 00:27:56.500 --> 00:27:59.500  Make sure that their current asset allocation is aligned with 564 00:27:59.500 --> 00:28:02.200  their financial plan and their long-term goals 565 00:28:02.200 --> 00:28:06.100  and objectives and you know, I think staying 566 00:28:05.100 --> 00:28:09.300  the course and remaining disciplined makes the 567 00:28:08.300 --> 00:28:11.700  most sense but making 568 00:28:11.700 --> 00:28:14.500  sure that your portfolio is aligned with what you want to achieve with. 569 00:28:14.500 --> 00:28:17.500  Your hard-earned capital is something investors could 570 00:28:17.500 --> 00:28:20.600  be doing into 2023 and then expect your 571 00:28:20.600 --> 00:28:23.300  advisor say everything's gonna be fine unless there's 572 00:28:23.300 --> 00:28:27.200  some sort of life-changing event that happens with the 573 00:28:26.200 --> 00:28:29.700  investor not necessarily the markets 574 00:28:29.700 --> 00:28:32.100  Casey. Thank you so much for your insights today. 575 00:28:32.100 --> 00:28:35.100  It's always a pleasure. We love talking to you and 576 00:28:35.100 --> 00:28:38.000  we look to have you back over the next 577 00:28:38.200 --> 00:28:40.700  couple of podcasts and I want to thank all of our listeners out there. 578 00:28:41.100 --> 00:28:45.500 Joining us today. Please feel free to access other 579 00:28:45.500 --> 00:28:49.500  podcasts that we have done and they 580 00:28:48.500 --> 00:28:51.300  can be accessed anywhere you get your 581 00:28:51.300 --> 00:28:54.500  podcast. So thanks everyone and we will see you 582 00:28:54.500 --> 00:28:57.900  next time symmetry Partners LLC is an 583 00:28:57.900 --> 00:29:00.500  investment advisor firm registered with the Securities 584 00:29:00.500 --> 00:29:03.500  and Exchange Commission The Firm only transacts business 585 00:29:03.500 --> 00:29:06.400  in states where it is properly registered or 586 00:29:06.400 --> 00:29:09.900  excluded or Exempted from registration requirements 587 00:29:09.900 --> 00:29:12.700  registration of an investment advisor 588 00:29:12.700 --> 00:29:15.200  does not imply any specific level of skill or 589 00:29:15.200 --> 00:29:18.200  training and does not constitute an endorsement of 590 00:29:18.200 --> 00:29:21.200  the firm by the commission. 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You should not assume that any discussion or 603 00:29:57.800 --> 00:30:01.100  information contained in this material Services the 604 00:30:00.100 --> 00:30:03.500  receipt of or as a substitute for 605 00:30:03.500 --> 00:30:05.900  personalized investment advice.

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